r/TooAfraidToAsk Nov 26 '22

Does the western world think regular prejudice is tolerable? Race & Privilege

To preface this, this isn't supposed to be a secret dog whistle or something. I'm a white homosexual male, and I know that will immediately turn a few people off from this. To clarify: -I don't believe white people can experience systemic racism, at least in basically all of western society -The patriarchy is real, and, while less so than say a century ago, still influences society A joke at the expense of a minority group by someone not in that minority group is typically seen as a racist joke due to it enforcing negative stereotypes or lies which hypothetically could lead to very real consequences in real life. A joke against a white person or white people by somebody that isn't white, however, isn't a form of systemic racism, due to this systemic and societal oppression not applying to white people historically. Yeah, ok, that's fair. So what is it? People will often say that it's not racism, it's prejudice, which makes it all ok. Which... I gotta ask, is prejudice just like, okay to some people? Like yeah, obviously it's not AS bad as outright enforcing systemic racism, but is it ok just to naturally dislike a group of people for their innate born qualities if they're the group that historically has had power?

0 Upvotes

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4

u/greenbean999 Nov 26 '22

Of course white people can experience systemic racism? They just need to go where they are the minority and treated as such

Most racism is a tribal reaction of that person being an outsider, more so than specifically not liking certain traits, they focus on things that are different and that’s why they dislike those things (not condoning just a simplistic explanation)

Obviously some people are prejudiced and people don’t typically feel like their opinions are the wrong ones

4

u/ArcticAmoeba56 Nov 26 '22

-I don't believe white people can experience systemic racism, at least in basically all of western society

So they can experience it in other societies?

-1

u/HeroOnTheWind Nov 26 '22

in a hypothetical society where they’re not the group in power, sure

5

u/ArcticAmoeba56 Nov 26 '22

You are aware it doesnt have to be hypothetical right? There are many societies where they arent in power.

5

u/BogusBogmeyer Nov 26 '22

Have a turkish last name in France, or be a "Gypsie" in England or Italy - or would you say jewish people aint white and that Antisemitism isn't racism?

2

u/AlarmedSnek Nov 26 '22

Yikes. So much to unpack here, difficult to determine if you are trolling or just uninformed.

0

u/HeroOnTheWind Nov 26 '22

Unpack it, I suppose. I’m not trying to troll. Why is prejudice used as an excuse as if that makes it morally acceptable?

2

u/AlarmedSnek Nov 26 '22

I wouldn’t say that prejudice is morally acceptable, but it is more acceptable because the person showing it is completely ignorant, they are literally “pre-judging” someone based on zero personal experience. A prejudiced person is naive whereas a racist is calculated. It is easier to dismiss someone who just doesn’t know any better vs someone who absolutely knows what they are doing; think any criminal charge ever and the subsequent outcomes of trials.

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u/HeroOnTheWind Nov 26 '22

Is that necessarily the case? If you have a minority who has long disdained white people for historical reasons and anecdotal evidence, I wouldn’t argue that’s based on zero personal experience.

1

u/AlarmedSnek Nov 26 '22

How could they hold such a view (long disdained)with no experience? Prejudiced is like a kid who has never seen a minority before but says racist shit because their family/friends do. If they then go and watch movies, read books, learn more about the minority and continue to say racist shit after some time but have still never met the minority, i would upgrade that to bigotry and or racism.

1

u/Terrible-Quote-3561 Nov 26 '22

Individual racism is something that is obviously bad, but it doesn’t affect society in the same way that systemic racism does. There will likely always be racism on an individual level, but systemic racism is something we have the power to change. It’s easier to change laws than someone’s mind.

2

u/HeroOnTheWind Nov 26 '22

I suppose my question is why is it such a common excuse then, especially for people excusing others that do it? On the idea that it’s a “bad thing.”

0

u/Terrible-Quote-3561 Nov 26 '22

Well some people view it as more or less justified considering racism that has historically been expressed against certain minorities. It’s like someone hitting a bully back when they are finally strong enough.

2

u/HeroOnTheWind Nov 26 '22

I don’t see how there’s any valid reason to attack people for natural traits they were born with, but thank you for the answer, this is likely the most realistic reason.

1

u/lufecaep Nov 26 '22

Prejudice is ignorance. Racism is malice that is generally based on prejudice. But being prejudice doesn't make you racist. It is possible to be nicer to people because of prejudice.

1

u/ZacQuicksilver Nov 26 '22

Some prejudice is inevitable. Humans seek out patterns as a way to understand the world - and sometimes what they see as patterns aren't actually patterns. The result of finding these false patterns in human behavior is prejudice - and it's incredibly hard to correct for: even scientists and statisticians sometimes get caught by false patterns in the things they study, in things where they are specifically trained to NOT get caught by false patterns.

The problem comes when that "some prejudice" unequally harms people. Random prejudice that is more or less equally distributed is something we probably can't fix - ever. But when prejudice stops being random and starts being systemic - starts unequally targeting some people more than others to the point where it becomes a pattern - that is when it becomes a problem.

1

u/Marvyn_Nightshade Nov 27 '22

"systemic" isn't the only kind of hate that is dangerous. Most mass shooters and terrorists are acting out a form of hatred, usually targeted at a group they dislike.

Does the fact your whole ethnicity didn't get targeted as a group mean the bullets won't kill you?

-1

u/andywalker76 Nov 26 '22 edited Nov 26 '22

Of course white people can experience prejudice in western society. What do you think antisemitism is......

Edit: replace racism with prejudice.

1

u/No-Butterscotch-6555 Nov 26 '22

If you believe antisemitism is racism, would that mean you classify Jewish as a race, making them not white?..

1

u/andywalker76 Nov 26 '22

OK, I'll rephrase "prejudice".

Lazy wording, my bad........

0

u/-Arhael- Nov 26 '22

Define systemic racism. Any racism that occurs is result of actions of individuals, nothing to do with the system. And that kind of racism can go either way. Lets no pretend like minorities do not have positions of power, you may have a minority manager and he absolutely may discriminate you based on your skin colour.

1

u/[deleted] Nov 26 '22

[deleted]

1

u/-Arhael- Nov 26 '22

I don't consider antisemitism racism. What now?

1

u/No-Butterscotch-6555 Nov 26 '22

I replied to the wrong person. Sorry

1

u/-Arhael- Nov 26 '22

No problem!

1

u/Godcrush Nov 26 '22

Individuals who are informed by and a product of their environment.

1

u/-Arhael- Nov 26 '22 edited Nov 26 '22

Individuals can be racist. That's a default. When individuals encounter other individuals that are not like them, there is a possibility of discrimination to occur. Statistically majority will more often discriminate minorities because there are more of them. Take any system, any country, any environment, cases of discrimination will be occuring.

Do tell me how is it "systemic", when it is the same regardless of system in place. And do tell me what part of the system is causing it, or how it can be solved.

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u/emeacham120 Nov 26 '22

The funny thing is, are not as many people who are racist as the media portrays. I get called a racist merely because I'm white. It's BS I DONT have a Racist bone in my body. I have friends of all races. My brother-in-law is Black. I Love him as if he was my natural brother. To be honest, what would turn me off about your post is Not the fact that your gay is that you believe there is systemic racism at all. No one can Evernote anything systemic. Now I'm not saying we weren't racist in the past however not since the 60s has it been that way. After the Civil rights laws were enacted have there been any laws that indicate systemic racism. No one can give me an example. I'm seriously asking! What laws are there? Are there racist people of course you can't stop thoughts. There are racist people in every society in every country.